Meeting and Befriending Your Inner Critic with Rosi Greenberg

Ashish: Hi, Rosi. It's so lovely to have you on our Happiness Squad podcast, my dear friend.

Rosi Greenberg: Thank you so much, Ashish. I'm so happy and honored to be here with you.

Ashish: For those listening, Rosie and I met up two days ago at a coffee shop, and she gave me her book, Everyone Has a Sam. We're going to dive into that today because it's incredibly relevant.

I met Rosie three years ago at Mobius's Next Practice Institute, a wonderful community of leadership practitioners, healers, and magical beings united in making the world a better place.

I was immediately taken by how amazing Rosi is. She has this incredible ability to capture rich dialogues into beautiful collages. But she's way more than an artist. Rosi has a master's degree from Harvard, a bachelor's degree in anthropology, and she's worked around the world.

I told her before we started that no one else could have handled this topic, the inner critic, in a way that resonates from children to adults.

My son got a hold of the book this morning, and I could see his facial expressions change just a few pages in, as if the book was seeing him for the first time. It touched me. I gave it to my wife, and she immediately loved it. I think you're going to love it too.

Rosi, thank you for joining us. Thank you for sharing. I hope everyone listening picks up a copy of the new edition that just came out. Let’s dig into it.

Rosi Greenberg: Thank you. I feel so seen by you acknowledging that this could have only come from me. That’s really my goal—to help people feel seen through it. This is not just my story; it's a universal story about the narratives we carry in our heads and hearts.

These narratives can lead us toward good but also astray. It's an honor to bring this work to others and see people deeply through it.

Ashish: So tell me, my friend, what inspired you? You've been doing this work for a while, but what inspired you to take the pen and write this book, Everyone Has a Sam?

Rosi Greenberg: Well, I was journaling that day. The book is actually my process of meeting my own Sam and going through that journey. It was my friend and mentor, Marshall Gans, who I've studied a lot of leadership work with.

We were walking around the lake one day, and he said, "Why don’t you draw Sam? What’s his name? Why don’t you draw him?" That’s in the book as well. But it was really a bigger exploration of the emotional elements of leadership—how do we recognize them and sit with them in deeper ways?

Ashish: So tell our listeners, who is Sam, and how did you come up with this metaphor?

Rosi Greenberg: Sam is my inner critic. He’s the voice that tells me I’m wrong all the time, that I’m not good enough, that I just can’t do things right. There’s this sense of something being wrong with me, which I think many of us can identify with.

Through my conversations with Marshall, I began to see Sam as an entity within me that wasn’t true, separate from who I really am.

Marshall shared that his wife had migraines, and a doctor suggested she name them. She did, and it transformed her relationship with the pain. So he suggested I name my inner critic.

I asked, "What’s your name?" and heard back, "Sam." Immediately, I thought, "That’s a dumb name for an inner critic—it’s too normal." But then I realized, that’s Sam telling me it’s a dumb name.

About a year later, I read something by Daniel Siegel, a neurobiologist and psychologist, about the inner critic system. He explained that it scans, alerts, and motivates—S.A.M. My mind was blown.

Ashish: Wow, scans, alerts, motivates—Sam. I asked Ashwin if he has a Sam. He said yes, and when I asked for its name, he said, "Sam’s good. Sam’s a good name."

So, friends, whether you have a Sam or not, I’m going to read a couple of things from Rosie’s beautiful book. Here’s a part where you're eating a sandwich:

“You should stop eating bread. You should make your own mayonnaise. Why don’t you have plates you love? You’re eating too many calories. You should have toasted it longer. Why did you toast it so long? You’re lazy for toasting it. You shouldn’t take so long for lunch. Maybe you should’ve made soup. You’re selfish. Why aren’t you using this time more productively? What will you do about that book you should have finished?”

Think about any of these messages. If you hear them, or if you’re a coach and you think, “You’re so unprofessional. That was a dumb thing to say. You got this all wrong. You’re only in this for the money. You don’t care about anything real.” If any of this resonates, maybe you have a Sam. Or maybe it's called something else.

Rosi Greenberg: I invite you to ask your inner critic what its name is. The only thing I suggest is don't name it after your parents. As tempting as that might be, it's your internalized representation of some of the things they say. It's not them themselves, so give it a little tweak—not your parents' name.

Ashish: I love that. Talk a little bit, Rosie, about the role this inner critic plays in our lives. Is it always harmful, or does it sometimes serve a useful purpose?

Rosi Greenberg: No, it definitely serves a purpose. Spoiler alert: at the end of the book, I come to love Sam because these parts of us help us fit into our early lives and our families. They help us scan the environment for belonging, for what it takes to fit into a group, a community, or an environment and stay safe.

It might stop us from running across the street or hold back our wildest creativity because the adults around us need us to be quieter. In some cases, there were traumatic situations people wouldn't have survived if they hadn't shut off parts of themselves. These parts help us stay in line or suppress parts of ourselves to survive. None of us would be here without this.

Ashish: Yeah, they serve us, right? In many cases, the reason we are where we are now is because our inner critics have played a big role in influencing our lives. The trick is becoming aware of them so we can take the functional parts rather than the dysfunctional ones.

Rosi Greenberg: Yes, exactly. We can show gratitude for what they're trying to tell us. Usually, there's a message there, and often some wisdom. If we can ask, "Okay, what's true here? What's specific? What detailed advice are you giving?"—and go down to the data level of what they're seeing without jumping to conclusions.

They scan, conclude, alert, and motivate, but if we focus on the data they’re scanning, we can then decide how we want to move forward.

Ashish: Yeah, I love that. So, talk to me a little bit about how, if we don’t see it and learn to work with it, these inner critics can really deter us from achieving our goals. There’s this one particular line in your book, Rosie, that really stood out to me.

Friends, there’s a drawing with two sets of words, and then there’s a third one. Rosie describes these critics and says, "Sam came from a strong line of critics. Those critics worked for people you’ve never even heard of. That’s how good they were."

They were so good that no one even heard of these people. Talk a little bit about how these critics can hold us back and what's possible.

Rosi Greenberg: Yeah, I love that line too. It's really true—when an inner critic is doing its job well, it means that its person is not going to take any risks. They won’t live into their most creative or wildest ideas because they’re just trying to be like everybody else. Or, they pressure themselves so much to be creative or outstanding that they spend all their energy on that instead of actually living and being.

This can hold us back. In teams, it starts to look like burnout, exhaustion, lack of risk-taking, or holding back innovation. It’s hard for teams and individuals to learn if everyone’s too scared of the repercussions of even slightly creative actions. Inner critics hate not knowing, and you have to embrace not knowing.

Ashish: Yeah. And think about the world we’re living in today, with so much uncertainty. Most leaders feel like they need to know everything, but the reality is we’re moving into highly unknowable territory.

Rosi Greenberg: Exactly. Nobody knows the answers, or we would’ve solved these problems already. A lot of the work you’re doing and I’m doing is helping people become more comfortable with the discomfort of complexity and building the emotional resilience needed to thrive in it. The inner critic piece is just one part of that broader project.

Ashish: That line reminded me of a story I read. I read a lot of different texts, and it’s a story about two angels having a conversation. Someone dies on earth, and one angel says to the other, "Today, the greatest general ever born on earth died."

The other angel responds, "I think you’ve got your facts wrong. That guy was nothing. He was just a little soldier. He didn’t do anything great. He just died of old age. What are you talking about?"

The first angel says, "No, he didn’t listen to his call. He heard it but didn’t follow through. He didn’t have the courage to step up when he could have. He chose comfort when he could have been the greatest. He had everything in him." That really spoke to me.

So, how does one face their Sam? In your work with leaders and individuals—you do this work in schools and with CEOs—how do you help people truly meet and see their Sam, not just hear them, but see them and befriend them?

Rosi Greenberg: It's a beautiful process. We start with noticing—drawing the inner critic physically on a piece of paper. Listeners can try this too. I tell them, "Draw your inner critic," and if the first thing you hear is, "I can't draw," that's your inner critic right there.

So, it's a very low bar to entry, but the critic immediately starts showing up. As people draw, they begin to hear things like, "That’s ugly," or "Your handwriting isn’t good enough," and we start writing those in. The first step is simply noticing.

Once we notice, the next step is understanding its origins and intent. Where did it come from? What was it trying to do for me? That’s where compassion and empathy come in. Sometimes I have people role-play from the critic's perspective, telling its story and finding this deep love for the person it’s been working with.

Then we shift to say, "I see what you intend. I’m going to take the wisdom and let go of the rest." We ask, "What details do you want me to know? What’s true here?" And we focus on the kind, compassionate wisdom. We let go of the mean talk and rewrite the rules for our lives, giving the inner critic a new role.

Sometimes it becomes the CEO of safety management, and often the critic likes being elevated because it’s been working so hard and not being listened to. By treating it with empathy and respect, we can ease both of our burdens in the process.

Ashish: Yeah, not being listened to, sometimes even shunned, like we hate those parts of ourselves, right? And yet, we feel so powerless against them. I was talking to my friend Ilya, the "Happiness Doctor of America."

We recorded a show together for his new series, Happy Hour with Dr. Ilya, on the Mental Health Television Network. I shared your book with him after our coffee together, and he said, "Oh yeah, I know the inner critic." He often asks people, "Where are you?" Are you in the driver's seat, the passenger seat, or the backseat? Some even say they're locked in the trunk.

The first step is just getting to the back of the car, then maybe to the passenger seat, and very gently, we swap places. But it starts with recognizing it, right? It’s not about rejecting the inner critic, but understanding the role it has played and what it’s really trying to do. Suppressing those parts only seems to make them stronger.

Rosi Greenberg: Exactly. This process can also apply to broader change work within organizations. Whenever there’s a change process, there will be people resisting it. If we start by noticing and understanding the origin and intent of that resistance, we realize people aren’t resisting change just for the sake of it.

There’s a deep intention there—maybe they’re trying to protect something. What losses are they afraid might happen if the change goes through?

It’s not just about jobs or control, but sometimes it’s about identity. In many organizations, people get competent with a certain role or system, and they might resist change because it threatens that sense of competence.

Once we can understand that, we can find the wisdom in the resistance, just as we would with our inner voices. We can hold competing values at once—acknowledging the losses while moving forward with change.

Ashish: It's so true. Most people who resist change aren’t resisting the change itself, but mourning or holding onto a loss tied to their identity or story. I’ve seen so many change efforts fail because the agents don’t acknowledge those losses. Even change agents can get uncomfortable with acknowledging them, thinking, "That’s your own issue." But how can you not?

Rosi Greenberg: I was working with a large company that had just gone through a reorganization. They had let go of many senior people, and those who remained were in shock, scared about losing their own jobs.

We could say things like, "We value you, and we’re moving forward together," and talk about the future, which was great. But no one acknowledged the fact that some of their close friends had just been let go, which was confusing and scary.

There was fear about their own jobs and about taking risks. Sometimes just acknowledging the difficulty and hurt honors the humanity in these big organizational decisions, and it can go a long way.

Ashish: So true, so true. I’m curious, though. You’ve done this work with organizations, schools, and universities—tell me a story or two about people who’ve done this workshop with you and experienced a big shift.

ctful this process can be. In: 2016

Rosi Greenberg: Oh, there are so many. Two stories come to mind. One is from a man who stood up, very bravely, in front of 300 people during one of my workshops. He said, "I’ve just realized I have become the Sam in my girlfriend’s head, and I’m going to talk to her differently." That was transformative for his relationship.

Another common experience is with parents who begin to think about how they speak to their children. Not from a place of guilt or shame—because every parent-child relationship will have some inner critic stuff come through—but from a place of awareness.

They realize how their interactions can either create or diminish negative messaging, creating either negative or positive environments for their kids.

I also worked with a class of fourth graders. We called their inner critics "Inner Meanies." They drew their Inner Meanies and created shields to help deal with fear.

The teacher even set up an Inner Meanie school in the corner of the classroom. The kids started using this language on the playground, saying things like, "Wait, is that your Inner Meanie coming out?" They even initiated the next incoming class of fourth graders with the book, continuing the practice without me.

One more story is from a small town in Kansas. I worked with an amazing coalition of people—librarians, healthcare workers, doctors, recovery specialists—on well-being in their community.

We did a workshop, and by the end, everyone had this realization about the power of affirmations. They started focusing on celebrating one another, acknowledging how overwhelmed they often felt with to-do lists and the next grant cycle. Taking the time to affirm and care for one another really transformed the way things felt within their organizations.

Ashish: That’s so beautiful, Rosie. I want to highlight something you said about the parent-child relationship. Look, I’m not proud of my early days as a parent, because we, consciously or unconsciously, all create Sams for our children.

When we tell a child, "Don’t do that," especially if they're about to put their finger in an electric socket, it’s the best thing we can do for them—but it also leaves a mark. They’re learning something, but they’re also learning, "I don’t want mom or dad to get angry." That’s a message too.

The reason I mention this is that, while we pick things up from our parents, even if you tried to protect your child from every negative message, they’d still encounter a Sam. My son met his Sam in kindergarten when another kid told him, "That’s the worst drawing ever."

You can’t avoid it. Even if you raised them in a bubble, someone or something will eventually introduce them to that inner critic. I’m reminded of the story of Siddhartha, the Buddha. His father kept him in a palace, sheltered from all suffering, but even he eventually stepped outside, saw suffering, and was transformed by it.

We all create Sams for our children. So if you’re thinking, "I’m horrible, I’ve created a Sam," just know—that’s your Sam telling you that.

Rosi Greenberg: Exactly.

Ashish: You can’t avoid it. And Sams play an important role. Siddhartha, despite his life of protection, chose to leave behind his princely robes and go on to teach others. So I’m not sure protecting children from all of this is good, even if it were possible.

Rosi Greenberg: Exactly. And I don’t think it’s possible.

Ashish: Exactly. If you don’t create the Sam, someone else will. What’s important is helping children understand it, so they can learn to work with it from an early age.

Rosi Greenberg: I love what you’re saying. For the parents out there, it’s nearly impossible to raise a child without some inner critic forming. Keeping a child safe, fed, and cared for—while being sleep-deprived for six years—is incredibly hard.

So, if you’re hearing your Sam say, "I did a bad job," that’s okay. Brene Brown talks about the difference between guilt and shame. It’s important to just say, "I could have done better," and let it slide off, rather than thinking, "I’m a terrible parent." No one is perfect.

Ashish: I’m the worst ever, right? Nobody does that!

Rosi Greenberg: Exactly. And then we start beating ourselves up. It’s important to let yourself off the hook for the times you didn’t do as well as you’d have liked—and know that’s 100% okay. Give yourself permission to mess up sometimes.

And also remember that hardship can lead to our greatest passions. I know some of the difficulties you’ve gone through helped create Happiness Squad and the amazing work you’re doing now. Sometimes, out of pain comes magic, and that’s okay.

Ashish: Absolutely. For anything to become gold, it has to be heated and reheated, so the impurities can burn away.

Rosi Greenberg: Exactly.

Ashish: For wood to become a flute, it has to be hollowed out. There’s so much growth through pain and struggle—not that you have to suffer to make it, but for most of us, it’s about how we find meaning in it. Without hard work and effort, without struggle, it’s hard to evolve. That’s how life teaches us.

Rosi Greenberg: Exactly. People used to tell me, "Your mess is your message," and when I was in the depths of despair and depression, I hated hearing that. I couldn’t believe there was any message in it. But looking back years later, of course, it became my message. When you’re in the thick of it, it’s hard to hear. But it’s true.

Ashish: You mentioned that one way to start working through the inner critic is by drawing it. Are there other exercises that can be helpful in this process of witnessing and befriending ourselves?

Rosi Greenberg: Another fun one is having people stand behind their chair and act as their inner critic or the risk manager part of their inner critic. They talk about what might be at risk for the person in the chair to engage in a conversation or meeting.

This helps create a space to talk about what's at stake and the level of psychological safety, but it's a little removed from someone speaking directly about themselves. For example, I could stand behind my chair and ask, "What might be at risk for Rosie to have this podcast conversation with Ashish right now?"

Ashish: So you're literally visualizing stepping into the role of the critic and talking to yourself. You could say, "Okay, what's at risk here?" and name things like A, B, C, D, E, and then write them down.

Rosi Greenberg: Exactly. You can write it down, or we could both stand behind our chairs and talk about what might be at risk in having this podcast conversation. We could name the potential barriers to psychological safety, like "They might say something stupid," or "What if it affects their future opportunities?"

It helps surface those concerns. Another exercise is tuning into the opposite of the inner critic—the wise sage. If a wise sage were to whisper in your ear, or whisper to your younger self, what would they say? What wisdom would they offer?

Ashish: Or even thinking about what your best friend or biggest well-wisher would say to you right now.

Rosi Greenberg: Exactly. And another fun one is writing a permission slip for yourself. What’s something you give yourself permission to do today? I work with a lot of groups, and one woman really touched me when she said, "I give myself permission to eat three whole meals a day."

That was a big step for her because of her relationship with food. It was such a beautiful moment of allowing. Your permission slip could be anything, like "I give myself permission to enjoy my life."

Ashish: I love that. What are you giving yourself permission to do today?

Rosi Greenberg: What would yours be today?

Ashish: My permission is to enjoy this. It’s been a big week, and I’m giving myself permission to enjoy the evening with a nice cigar, just relax. I’ve been battling this idea, but after this conversation, I feel like I’m going to sit in my garden, enjoy a cigar, and end the week on a beautiful note.

Rosi Greenberg: So often our critics don’t let us just relax and enjoy life. We feel like we have to keep working, keep striving. This week, my permission is to enjoy the last week of August and not feel like I need to be hustling or figuring out all my work plans for the fall. Just enjoy and maybe play some pickleball if I want to.

Ashish: No surprise, Rosie, no surprise. "I wish I’d let myself be happier," and "I wish I hadn’t worked so hard" are two of the most common regrets of the dying, based on the work of Bronnie Ware. It’s this inner critic, this notion. I also love the image of Sam you described—when it was 95% of your head and then became even bigger, while you felt smaller.

That happens to so many of us. We don’t live the life we’re meant to because we’re constantly listening to this voice.

This is so beautiful. I can’t even tell you—it’s been two days since I got your book, and I’ve already flipped through it four or five times.

Rosi Greenberg: Thank you. I’m touched. I hope it’s a message to us all to start, even in small ways, living the life we want to live. Whether it’s taking five minutes to enjoy something you might not have otherwise—it’s a great start.

It doesn’t have to be a major transition all of a sudden, but just appreciating and enjoying who we are and the amazingness of this life. Of course, there’s struggle, but that enjoyment helps bolster us through the challenges.

Ashish: Exactly. Well, thank you for this beautiful, heartfelt conversation, Rosie. Thank you for sharing your wisdom and for the beautiful work you’re doing in the world. I know you and I will do great things together.

I want to bring your wisdom, playfulness, creativity, and intelligence to the listeners of this podcast, to our Happiness Squad community, and to the clients we serve.

Because, friends, if we want to show up as our whole selves out there, and if we really want to, as leaders, accept others as whole beings—with all their perfections and imperfections—witnessing and befriending, and getting skilled at working with your Sam, is the first step. Thank you, my friend, for this beautiful conversation and for joining us.

Rosi Greenberg: Thank you. And thank you for all you’re doing, leading with happiness and flourishing in the workplace. It’s so inspiring. Thank you.

Ashish: My pleasure.

Rosi Greenberg: Dear friend.

Ashish: Bye.